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Talk:Hurian Federation
How does a dictatorship have such a high GDP per capita????? Is it like a fascist one? Synthic 13:35, April 20, 2012 (UTC) I'm wondering how a collection of countries with GDP's of no more than $80 billion each, some as low as $1 billion in a matter of 11 years become a national equivalent of the modern U.S. with everyone owning solar powered cell phones. Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 14:50, April 20, 2012 (UTC) Its a kind of magic, magic, magiiiiic ... (Queen, 1986) More than this... I recomend you (the author) to have a look to other nations before choosing territories becouse you are using Togo, that is part of DDR in FW and you are using Guinea, whose northern part (Boké region) is part of Euskadi in FW. Please, have a look to National Info of Future World where you can see a map. --BIPU 17:37, April 20, 2012 (UTC) A dictatorship being poor is a sterotype. The Soviet Union (dictatorship), had the second highest GDP in the world up until 1991. Nazi Germany had a relatively high GDP up until WWII. Zimbabwe up until the mid-90s had a currency that was the equal to the U.S. dollar. Syria and Lybia? Both are very wealthy countries that were controlled (in the latter's case), dictator's. As for the GDP of the country, I'm very aware of the economic issue. Since this is an alternate universe, I decided I'd pretend that the leaders there had half a brain, and didn't screw up the economics. My hope was that after the Cold War kinda went backwards, that West Africa was spared the civil wars pretty much induced by the U.S. and the Soviet Union. So yeah, this kinda is magic. :) Plus, I'm also counting on a few other things. First is foreign investment, much like Nigeria, Mandinka was easier to deal with than a corrupt state with rotating leaders, if you know what I mean. Second, political stability, allowed the region to develop without the civil wars that basically ruined the economies of the constitute nations (such as the civil war in Liberia). And third, the locals themselves, who let didn't let petty issues such as race and religion divid them in the progress they begged for years too have. And thanks for the map. Been looking for that thing. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 18:46, April 20, 2012 (UTC) And for the sake of keeping the peace, I'll be lowering the overall nation GDP. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 18:52, April 20, 2012 (UTC) I´m with you when you say a dictatorship has not to be poor. Yes, Lybia was a good example and Syria is a good example too (they were richer than other neighbors but they were not "rich" nations. Even Iraq was a good example becouse in economic (and others) terms Iraqui people lived better with Sadam than now. Anyway, you are claiming a GDP higher than the European Union average and I`m afraid it is too high even for FW. If you want to maintain your GDP I suggest you to increase your population (it is easy to explain mass migrations in Africa) and this way to lower your GDP per capita. It is not only a political matter, it is an economical matter. You can have a dictatorship or a democracy but the nations you are using cant become an industrialized nation in only a decade.--BIPU 19:38, April 20, 2012 (UTC) Thank you. Sorry about the GDP issue. I lowered it and I'll be bumping up the population to supplement that. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 19:48, April 20, 2012 (UTC) I fixed the Mandinka borders with love. There should be no border conflicts with Togo, Euskadi, or the DDR. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 00:09, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Interesting work. Hope you go far. Woogers - talk ( ) 00:16, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Thanks. :D --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 00:27, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Everett has never attacked Mandinka. Your military is far too advanced for an African nation with only 11 years of development and a $1.2 trillion GDP. Space based war vessels are not allowed until Future World Next Generation. Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 02:05, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I wasn't talking in terms of all-out combat, and more like Israel's attack on Iraq's nuclear facilities. Also, Mandinka's history is an alternate version of the region, where the area isn't plauged with wars, and before the nation's creation, it was generally stable. Mandinka has only furthered advancements in the region, not made them. I'm still working on the history part, and will add it later. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 02:35, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Oh yeah, and Mandinkda is capable of space combat at all, nor did I mention them being capable of it in the first place. I simply stated that they had semi-atmospheric carriers, and space stations. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 02:39, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Here's the general outline for Mandinka. *The Ivory Coast has it's prosperous era under Félix Houphouët-Boigny, and after his death, the country doesn't flip on it's head. Foreign investment and competant leadership ensure that the country is able to grow to it's full potential. *Ghana and Benin unite in 1992, and avoid any political strife that plagued them in during the period. Hydro-electric production and banking are expanded in both, and the two undergo modernization between 1984-2001. *Samuel Doe is killed by the Liberian military, and doesn't launch the coup the sent Liberia down the drain in the 80's. Liberia continues to recieve economic aid, and modernization goes on unabieted. *Sierra Leone's politicans come to terms on their differing ideals after a terrorist group attempting to start a civil war and take over in the process is stopped, and diamond mining is expanded. Life gets better for most of the population, and it's wealth is comparable to that of Kuwait, par the responsible handling of government fund and interational aid. *Guinea recieves economic aid from the U.S. and Europe, and advisors assist with the construction of vital infastructure in the country. The mining and lumber industries are supported by the government, and help increase the GDP in the rual areas they are based, thus leading to the increased demand for goods from the cities, propping up the industrial and service markets. *Trade in the region, unimpeded by civil war or corruption, lead to the hasty formation of the West African Economic and Monetary Union, which improves the local market. Exports begin to make up for the imports needed to improve the local industries, and most of the region's debt to creditors is paid off by 1995. The economic sitiution in West Africa has improved greatly since the 1950's. *By the time the nation of Mandinka is formed, oil exports, technology firms, and banking are major industries in nations that make up the new one, and Maurice Williams expertise on economics help propel Mandinka's economy greatly, especially once Lagos is annexed. The additional firms and businesses assist the country greatly. *As for technology, most of that is taken from international treaties, personal research, and corporations operating independently in the nation. Generally speaking, the region that now forms Mandinka took a totally different turn in the 1950's. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 03:05, April 21, 2012 (UTC) It Begins This will make things very interesting indeed. Its kinda like Saudi Arabia mixed with North Korea. And you must spend a huge amount of money on your military. At least a third of GDP. Before this, I was widely considered to have the second most powerful military, and this dwarfs it. We'll have to talk trade and human rights one day. Woogers - talk ( ) 05:46, April 21, 2012 (UTC) A third of the GDP? I don't recall any nation having to do that. Eritrea's military constitutes nearly a tenth of their population, and needs only a fraction of the money. Also, a based the military off of Everett's if you haven't noticed. <.< And I haven't even explained the pay soldiers receive, their equipment, or even the current state of the military. So I wouldn't go jumping on the cost just yet. But considering the fact Mandinka's a military nation, I wouldn't be surprised if what your saying is right. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 06:32, April 21, 2012 (UTC) ::Of course... but Eritrea military is a group of pastors armed with shotguns and you ar talking about carrier, thousand of planes, space weapons, etc. To be realistic what you say is impossible, but even if it were possible it will be very very very espensive.--BIPU 09:07, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Lol. Eritrea also doesn't have supercarriers. Much less three of them. Or dabbling in space warfare. I suppose if soldiers get half of minimum wage, it might begin to get somewhere, but the new Ford carriers will run the US Navy upward of ten billion a piece. That's why only five countries have carriers in real life. Maybe ten in Future World. That kind of money is better spent elsewhere, in my opinion, like infrastructure. But, then again, my military is generally defense-only, so its not as bug as it could be with my economy. And strength seems to be a focus for your country, so maybe the cultural differences make up for it. On the space front, I think Everett is the only country thus far with big military space spending. I have a few fighters in space to shoot down missiles, but that's about it. Big ol' spaceships surely will have a big price tag, but we'll wait for you to write some more before we talk about that. I await the next installment. Woogers - talk ( ) 07:47, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Where did you buy your fusion warheads? Did you buy then in the supermarket? OR did you find the blueprints in the street?... 4500 planes? 170 ships? Wow... I have read many extraordinary things in FW but this sis the most impossible nation I have never read. *Only Everett has fussion technology and they sell the ability to manufacture reactor to other nations if they want. And obvilusly your nation cant the ability to investigate such technology. *Have you ever read about the cost of military stuff?? Pleas... have a look and the you will realize that is impossible to have the military you say. Carriers???? Space program??? Oh my god... *Have a look here, List of countries by militay expenditure chose the money you want to spend and anlize the kind of armed forces that the budget you are telling can provide. You can have the money of Nigeria and the army of USA--BIPU 08:59, April 21, 2012 (UTC) The Allied States Military just got dwarfed in two days. -Signed by Super Warmonkey, please refer to these pages for more: (talk • ) 09:18, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I admit, I got carried away with the nukes. We'll just handle that right now. As for the size, you can have the large army without the expense. Example. Vietnam and North Korea. Both have very large armies, but neight receive the serious bankrolling smaller militaries like South Korea or the UK get, though both have superior firepower. As for the size of the air force, size isn't a deciding factor. Ethiopia has 500-700 aircraft, but the 400 fighter air force of France is easily superior in everyway. Additionally, the Ethiopian's pay their pilots far less, and pay less for their air force (far less), though they were still able to do a good job during the Eritrea-Ethiopian War. Size, technology, and cost are teniously related in the military, but no so at the same time. I know, it is. Anyway, that comes from the fact that ethiopian planes are made to fly out and blow things uup, while French ones are made to break the sound barrier and scare the enemy into submission. Also, when it comes down to the Mandinka military, the pay of the soldiers is about $50 bucks a month. Those in the MEF receive far lass, and inferior equipment compared to the regular force (likes AKs, RPKs, and RPGs, with regular fatigues and no armor). Now the navy! It is made up of second-hand warships, purchased from other nations. This was obvisously before Mandinka's rep took a hit in the knee. All others were constructed by the growing defense industry. As far as railguns and cloning are concerned, that's a recent development. And the military expenditure. Mandinka has $1 trillion bucks to play with. It's active military force is the size of the RL. Chinese military, with tech slightly superior. China spend $116 billion dollars on it military, meaning that Mandinka must spend about $200 billion on it's military. That bring it to about a sixth of the nation GDP. Nigeria makes half a trillion dollars a year, and that's its untapped potential, plus the civil war, and recent issues. Mandinka has about the same population, resources, minus the civil wars, corruption, and religious strife. So I would say it's safe for Mandinka to have it's current GDP. This hopefully solved all the issues. I hope... --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 15:51, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I don't have any "issues" per se, but just wanted to pointed out that North Korea doesn't have superior firepower to South Korea. Same question of quality over quantity. You'very assuaged my concerns mostly, but didn't talk about space really. Woogers - talk ( ) 16:43, April 21, 2012 (UTC) If you don't plan on dominating the battlefield in every little conflict in this game, I'm fine with it. Also, try to not get involved in conflicts prior to you joining, like the Siege of Yarphei. About the Middle Eastern thing, I don't think the Coalition will allow you to join in with your current dictoral policies. -Signed by Super Warmonkey, please refer to these pages for more: (talk • ) 16:45, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I'm sorry, I'd thought there be some confusion. I meant that South Korea had superior firepower, despite its smaller military. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 16:59, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Also, I didn't plan on them joining in on the side of the Coalition. I wanted them to join on the said of Afganistan, against the Coalition. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 17:01, April 21, 2012 (UTC) Yeah, that will be fine. Again, as long as joint Europan-America-Emirate forces aren't squashed by the Third World. -Signed by Super Warmonkey, please refer to these pages for more: (talk • ) 17:08, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I kinda think your overdoing the whole Third World thing. Mandinka isn't a Third World nation. Stop hatin'. D: --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 17:11, April 21, 2012 (UTC) :I'm all for imagination, but as a RL inhabitant of the most advanced nation of sub-Saharan Africa (South Africa), I can say that you can do whatever you want with the economy - there will always be high poverty and illiteracy and unemployment. Government, no matter how modern or strict, will always be incompetent and corrupt in comparison to the rest of the world. Besides, with a nation with policies like yours, there would be sanctions just like South Africa was sanctioned. Our economy came to a complete halt when that happened. Rather take it a step back and try to see this in a tad more realistic light. -Signed by Super Warmonkey, please refer to these pages for more: (talk • ) 17:34, April 21, 2012 (UTC) :::This is FW and we usually allow things that are almost imposible in RL. This nation could be claiming to be an emergent nation, an "regional power" under construction, the most advanced nation in Africa.... and all these things could be acepted. Nevertheless, he is claiming to be the world superpower and this is IMPOSIBLE in a nation like this. It is imposible to have such military, it is imposible to have satellites, lasers, spaceships and all that stuff and it is imposible mainly becouse those things cant be purchased in internet and no advanced nations will share the technology with this nation.--BIPU 08:56, April 22, 2012 (UTC) ::::That last sentence is not entirely accurate. Although I vehemently protest the political situation in this country, it still is a member of the OIS. If Yarphei is any indication, there is much hope to be had for future reforms. And I just got through decommissioning a mostly-modern navy. Like he said, most of his navy is made of ships he bought from other countries; I'd be open to sell some old ships and airplanes off. Just not anything too fancy or classified. Woogers - talk ( ) 10:41, April 22, 2012 (UTC) :::::I have no problem with the political situation. Euskadi yes, of course... but DDR is maybe glad with this nation becouse it can be a good place to sell weapons and an potetntial ally to stick the finger in the eyes of americans. The problem is not the nation, the problem is that the player is claiming for this nation to be a world power and this is not possible. It is not possible to have the technology he said the nation has and it is impossible to have satellites, laser defenses and all the star wars stuff. One thing is to have several second hand military stuff and one different is to have aircrafcarriers, ICBMs, fusion warheads, etc. Firstly becouse nobody is going to sell this things to this nation, second becouse this nation dont have the money or the technology to manufacture themselves.--BIPU 11:00, April 22, 2012 (UTC) "The MAF maintains six semi-atmospheric warships, each capable of maintaining and deploying 200 fight craft and bombers, 70,000 ground troops, and 6 nuclear warheads." This is excessive. No country on Earth in FW has this capability yet. A vessel of this size would be the equivalent of 2 1/2 Nimitz-class aircraft carriers attached to about ten San Antonio class Amphibious transports... that can fly. The Union of Everett won't have something even remotely like this until at least 2015 although full sized capabilities like this will be developed in 2022. See Future World Next-Generation if you want to add this kind of tech to your nation in the future. Ham Ham Time (User/Talk/World/WAT) 17:29, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I'll fix that right now...<.< --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 17:36, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I'm sorry... but this remembers me very very much the old times of Sout America. This military is IMPOSSIBLE and trying to play this will bring problems with everybody. You have talked about North Korea, well... maybe north korea has many artillery pieces from the 50s but they have a more important problem... their soldiers have nothing to eat. Why? Becouse they spend more in military than in food. If you spend 10% of your GDP in military, you will have a zombi army but not more than this. Finally, this is not a star wars game. --BIPU 18:43, April 21, 2012 (UTC) I recall speaking of Star Wars. And half of North Korea's population is in the military, leaving few workers to cultivate the fields. Plus, North Korea has little to no money. Mandinka's population can support the military, the same way the Soviet Union was able to support's its own military. Same GDP, same population. I won't go into the details, but this military isn't impossib le, and I've already explained why. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 19:20, April 21, 2012 (UTC) brazil wat. (ᵒᴥᵒ) MineCraftian (Talk) (Skandinavia - Baltic Republic - Oil City - Mozambique) (ᵒᴥᵒ) 22:00, April 27, 2012 (UTC) x2 -Signed by Super Warmonkey, please refer to these pages for more: (talk • ) 22:01, April 27, 2012 (UTC) Don't know what x2 is, but yes. I can revert it, but seeing as how the ASA and Everett, and practically half the nations in FW are marching across the globe, I found it somewhat...appropriate to join in on the action. I looked up Brazil, and appearently, the auther gave up on it, and said anyone was welcome to keep working on it if they wished. So I decided to invade it! :D --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 22:04, April 27, 2012 (UTC) Don't revert it, we only want you do commit to it, and not go about it like I am going about Canada (completely ignoring its existence and treating it like my hat). -Signed by Super Warmonkey, please refer to these pages for more: (talk • ) 22:14, April 27, 2012 (UTC) I won't. I'm working on the war, so I plan to have something done in the next week at least. :) --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 22:43, April 27, 2012 (UTC) GDP & GDP Per Capita Maybe I'm wrong, but with a GDP of 1.21 trillions and a population of 167 millions the GDP per capita is around $ 7,200 and not the $29,000 that is in the article. And then, with a GDP per capita of a bit more than 7,000 maybe it is difficult to explain people having cars, computers, mobile phones and internet acces. --BIPU 16:45, May 2, 2012 (UTC) Thank you for bringing that to my attention. With the current GDP per capita, that would have required Mandinka to make $5 trillion dollars a year. Should probably factor in the Brazilian conquest... Anyway, you can still have all the luxuries, because the cost of living isn't as high as other nations around the world, especially when you have things such as slave labor. --[[User:Vivaporius|'"Truth fears no questions..."']] 16:58, May 2, 2012 (UTC) What % of their rent are your citizens to pay by taxes? If they have 7,000 dollars a year and you take (for example 25%) 1800 you will only left them 4,800 dollars to live during the year. Even if the cost of life is low, your population could be condemned to starving. And... with 1800 dollar from taxes for every people you could collect about 300 billions. Spending 157 billions in your military you only have around 150 billions for hospitals, education, rodas, water, wastewater, trasnportation, etc, etc, etc, etc, As in the real life, you have to choose. Maybe you can spend 150 billions in your military but if you do, your population will be illiterate, ill, starving, etc, Your nation cant be an evil spending 150 billions in military and being an industrialized and advanced nation at the same time. It is totally imposible and you must choose.--BIPU 18:26, May 2, 2012 (UTC)